War Diaries Talk

“Julius Caesar came to see us in the afternoon."

  • marie.eklidvirginmedia.com by marie.eklidvirginmedia.com

    To cyngast: In regard to your question, (“Julius Caesar came to see us in the afternoon.’" What?) in the diary link http://talk.operationwardiary.org/#/subjects/AWD00035xh - 2 Division: 6 Infantry Brigade: 1 Battalion King's Liverpool Regiment. I think this could be a humorous description, maybe of Col. Steavenson " who went round the trenches in the afternoon, to say goodbye to us all on leaving for England".

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  • ral104 by ral104 moderator, scientist

    I've had a look at the page, I don't think that's it. The two things seem unconnected.

    Unfortunately, though, I haven't got a clue what it might be referring to!

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  • marie.eklidvirginmedia.com by marie.eklidvirginmedia.com

    Sorry, seem to have made a wrong suggestion about this.

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  • cyngast by cyngast moderator

    Thank you both for weighing in on this. I don't think that the comment is related to Col. Steavenson's leaving, as the comment appears two days before the telegram arrived with Col. Steavenson's orders.

    I just had to ask about it though. Such a seemingly off-the-wall remark! Do you think it might be that someone who had been transferred out of the battalion, whose nickname happened to be Julius Caesar, happened to come back for a visit?

    I don't think he's referring to a superior officer as he has always been quite respectful in any mention of them. Although he always referred to other officers in the regiment by last name only. No rank mentioned. (Not very useful for tagging!) Oddly, any mention of NCOs or privates always includes the rank.

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  • marie.eklidvirginmedia.com by marie.eklidvirginmedia.com

    Came across an article with a mention of ‘Julius Ceasar’ on the following google link. It still does not answer the question though.

    World War I: 100 Years of Espionage (A popular way to send codes during WWI was sending coded messages through telegrams) The first Russian used cipher system in the battlefield was the ancient Julius Ceasar cipher system. substitutes a group of digits for each letter of the alphabet. - See more at: http://www.numbers-stations.com/WWI-Espionage#sthash.KqdmHelA.dpuf

    If you bring this article up – use the Find key which is helpful for finding things quickly in an article: Near the top of the text press Control F, a box will appear in the top right corner of the page- enter Julius and it will mark the text containing the Julius reference in Red in the article.

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  • ral104 by ral104 moderator, scientist

    Thanks, Marie - interesting link. Pre-computers substitution ciphers like that were pretty hard to break, unless you had the mapping key.

    @cyngast - I'd wondered the same. I think an acquaintance is the most likely explanation, but it also occurred to me that it could be a nickname for some sort of weapon, a little like coal boxes, whizz bangs, etc. If so, it's not one I've seen before. And seeing that the author's tone at that point seems relatively light-hearted, I think the former suggestion is more likely.

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  • cyngast by cyngast moderator

    That's a thought about the weapons. If he had said Jack Johnson or Black Maria came to visit we would know exactly what he meant. And I have seen references to shells "arriving" in the trenches.

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  • ral104 by ral104 moderator, scientist

    Maybe we're onto something...

    I'll have another dig around and see if I can find out anything more.

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  • cyngast by cyngast moderator

    There were fairly frequent comments about whiz-bangs coming over.

    I'm trying to remember where they were...Givenchy maybe. Cambrin? Cuinchy? Or maybe a little farther north. They spent a lot of time in that general area.

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  • Charalinn by Charalinn

    What about cockney slang terminology? Julius Caesar is geezer. So who would be the geezer? Could it be Stevenson?

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  • ral104 by ral104 moderator, scientist

    No, I don't think so. He's not referred to like that anywhere else.

    I can't find any references to Julius Caesar as a slang term, but I'll keep on looking. I did find a few people who were named Julius Caesar, however! https://livesofthefirstworldwar.org/search#Category=lifestories&FreeSearch=caesar&PageIndex=1&PageSize=20&Facets[0][Key]=first_name_s&Facets[0][Value]=Julius+Caesar

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  • Charalinn by Charalinn

    Brophy, John and Partridge, Eric
    "The Daily Telegraph Dictionary of Tommies' Songs and Slang, 1914-18. Introduction by Malcom Brown."
    Barnsley, S. Yorkshire: Frontline Books, (Imprint of Pen and Sword Books Limited) 2008
    xviii, pages 9 - 238
    ISBN: 978 - 1 - 84115 - 710 - 5
    Not sure where this could be found but maybe helpful for the slang. Coincidentally John Brophy served in the service area of the kings Liverpool regiment.

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  • ral104 by ral104 moderator, scientist

    Thanks for the reference! Perhaps the IWM has a copy in their collection.

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